Talk:Charismatic

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Questioning the article

There were some statements made here without sufficient substantiation. e.g.
"There appears to be a great deal of evidence which shows that, since 1975, the Charismatic movement has been influenced by the Latter Rain Movement and its influential teachers (such as William M. Branham)." I would like examples of the actual theology of the Latter Rain Movement, e.g. the "Manifest Sons of God" theology, being evident in the Charismatic movement, prior to this statement being made.

Furthermore, the writer states:
"It appears that modern-day Charismatics and Pentecostals are far more united in experience and theology because both movements have adopted elements of Latter Rain teachings." Again, in order to say this, you would have to find theologies that were in common and point them out. Otherwise this is purely conjecture.

Another issue, is that the Latter Rain Movement took a lot of things from the Pentecostalism of the time, which isn't bad. Even if a good theology or practice has its origins in them, it isn't a negative thing. Pentecostalism was, like most movements, in flux since its inception, and so its theology, or focuses have changed over the years. For example, many early Pentecostal were postmillenialists, but now this isn't accepted as proper Pentecostal theology in most denominations. I have interviewed a few people in that movement, who actually went to the Bible college they made in North Battleford, after leaving Bethel(now Central Pentecostal College), where their movement really started according to them in the late 40s, for the PAOC(Pentecostal Assemblies of Canada) archives. I found that they weren't that different from the form of Pentecostalism practiced then, minus some of their ideas. But a lot of things attributed to them here, like the fivefold ministry, were already current. Russel.gauthier July 15, 2006

It seems this article may need to be reworked. I know very little of this movement or it's theology, so hopefully someone else (e.g., Russel.gauthier) can help edit this article. I added a "citation needed" template which will help bring notice to the section that needs better referencing/sources. To note, it is not acceptable to leave personal comments on the actual article, so I removed these - no big deal, but now you know. ;) If you desire to make a large edit, please run it by everyone on this discussion page as it will go up for peer review. We appreciate your efforts to make this a more accurate and resourceful article. JordanBarrett (talk) 17:29, 15 July 2006 (PDT)

Russell, You're questions regarding specific statements in the article (noted above) appear valid. In looking at the "history" of the page, the bulk of the information was imported from Wikipedia back in Nov, 2005. However, it is interesting that the particular content you have questioned remains intact there, especially since they have tons more editors/contributors. It might be good to try your questions there too. In the interim, we (you) may freely pursue selected edits which improve the accuracy and integrity of the article. Even though some existing comments may not be sufficiently cited, we should leave them with a note that "Citation is needed" (as Jordon has done) for the time being. Thanks for your interest. Gomarus 05:52, 16 July 2006 (PDT)

I'm a charismatic who is very well versed in the issues discussed on this page. Although my time is somewhat limited, I would be glad to contribute to the discussion in whatever way others would find helpful. This site [1] is a good starting point for understading the "Latter Rain" issue.Theriddes 21:49, 16 July 2006 (PDT)

You are welcome to participate in the evolution of this article. The site you reference is interesting, however, I am usually suspect of sites that don't plainly provide author info and credentials. Also, in future editing, please remember that non-Reformed theology should be limited to factual, neutral presentation, while Reformed perspectives may be presented positively (non-neutral), for which see Theopedia:Why Reformed? and the Theopedia:Writing guide. Gomarus 05:14, 17 July 2006 (PDT)

Dating of charismatic worship

The "charasmatic" mode of Christian worship and community is far, far older than the 20th century. One might even look as far back to the Montanists who, before they went off the deep-end, were not so different from "charasmatic" Christians of today, and appear a lot like Pentacostal Christianity with the combination of the focus on various charismata coupled with a strong ethical code. Chrismon 21:49, 19 December 2006 (UTC)

I would agree with you. Feel free to make the necessary changes, yet, make sure the article still represents the fact that the more "official" movement did take place more recently although similar ideas may be older. Another example is open theism - it may be a newer movement, yet its views can go back to the 16th (or 17th?) century. JordanBarrett (talk) 17:03, 20 December 2006 (UTC)